Minutes for October 13, 2006
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DRAFT
Board of Trustees
Regular Meeting
Friday, October 13, 2006
1:00 p.m. – Building D&E
Madame Chairman Wilma Weglein called the meeting to order at 1:00 p.m.
Ms. Weglein led the Pledge of Allegiance.
Ms. Weglein called the roll. Mr. Bailey and Ms. McCahan were excused.
Ms. Weglein requested the minutes of September 26, 2006 be carried over to the next meeting.
Mr. Carillion made a motion to approve the September 8, 2006 minutes. Second Mr. Smith.. On page 9, Ms. Richards requested “There would be nominations from the floor” in her Committee report to reflect the nominations were for the HOA Nominating Committee, not the slate of officers. The minutes were approved as amended.
Ms. Richards made a motion to approve the September 14, 2006 minutes. Second Ms. Donahue. Motion carried unanimously.
Mr. Keegan made a motion to approve the October 2, 2006 minutes. Second Ms. Richards. Motion carried unanimously.
Ms. Donahue read the Treasurer’s report. (Exhibit A)
Loretta Lynch asked Ms. Richards if she had been, or was currently, involved with ARCC. Ms. Richards responded she had been, not now. Ms. Lynch asked Mr. Keegan if he had been, or was currently involved with ARCC or the Violations Committee. Mr. Keegan responded he had been a member of the Violations Committee. Mr. Carillion answered that Sue McCahan had been involved with ARCC. Ms. Lynch had heard recently there is a person involved in one of those committees who wanted to become Interim Community Manager. Ms. Lynch expressed reservations about considering this person.
Nancy Eisele reminded the Board that when the residents acquired the Bay from Avatar they voted on the manager/Board form of government and not the management companies. Ms. Eisele is concerned that management companies are concerned with their profit first. Ms. Eisele reminded Mr. Hunt he had promised a financial statement for this meeting. Mr. Hunt responded there would be a current fiscal position attached to his after action report (which will be distributed next week).
Dean Woolery asked if his letter concerning the billiards room had reached the Board. Ms. Weglein responded the Board received Mr. Woolery’s letter and it would be discussed under new business.
Ms. Weglein commented Mr. Dobbins withdrew his name from the running. Ms. Harty and Ms. Daddario are still candidates. Ms. Weglein received a resume from Mr. Rudy Walther from Destin, FL after the deadline. Ms. Weglein acknowledged an employee has expressed interest in the interim position.
Ms. Weglein commented on a discussion she had with Yvonne Claiborne of Bray Beck & Koetter concerning Ms. Daddario in which it was suggested Ms. Daddario might consider contract work for three or four months to assist the financial officer. Mr. Malek commented his office received NPT’s completed contract. A letter should be available next week. Ms. Richards asked if the interim manager position and the financial assistance function would be vested in the same person. Ms. Weglein responded Eddie Geer could handle the interim position if the financial end was given to someone else. Mr. Carillion commented in his discussions with Mr. Geer, Mr. Geer had said he liked his job as special projects coordinator.
There was general discussion regarding contracting Ms. Daddario as a financial consultant to assist Mara Marsocci and straighten out the financial system.
Mr. Keegan identified Ken Austin, the Code Enforcement Director, as the employee who applied for the interim position. Ms. Weglein reiterated Mr. Austin submitted his resume after the deadline, and said if Mr. Austin was considered, then Mr. Walther would have to be also. Mr. Keegan responded since the discussion has included other employees, the Board should hear from Mr. Austin. Mr. Glashauser [from the audience] interrupted with a point of order saying that if anyone else was to be interviewed, the position should have been advertised. Mr. Malek responded there was a deadline, but the Board can choose not to hire “any of those people” and to reopen the interview process. Mr. Glashauser said if the interview process was reopened, it would have to be advertised. Mr. Hunt responded [your] charter and rules and regulations remain silent on the issue; in presumption of “no prohibition”, [we] have operated without advertising for an interim position. The Board essentially can meet at any time and hire whomever it wants. Mr. Malek commented the Board imposed a deadline on itself, and since this is an interim position and the charter is silent on it, the Board is free to impose or extend another deadline, or the Board can vote immediately to entertain an interview with Mr. Austin and who ever else it chooses. Mr. Keegan said the reason he brought it up was the discussion that Ms. Daddario might be contracted as a financial consultant. Mr. Malek said the interim position is a contract position that does not have to be a specific timeframe, but could be stated “until such time Barefoot Bay Recreation District finds a permanent manager.”
Ms. Howard commented if the Board were to consider an in-house person, Ed Geer had been consistently involved in all phases of the management operation to date. Ms. Richards asked if a motion were required to extend the deadline. Mr. Malek concurred.
Mr. Smith made a motion to extend the deadline “through today”. Mr. Smith commented “in other words, I think we should accept what is in front of us today. Mr. Austin should be allowed to speak.” Ms. Weglein said in that case, Mr. Walther’s application would have to be considered as well. Mr. Malek interjected that under Mr. Smith’s motion, the Board would be considering Mr. Walther’s application as well.
Mr. Carillion asked what would be the earliest the Board could convene an emergency meeting. Mr. Malek responded the Board could have one on Monday if it wanted to. Mr. Keegan asked what the emergency meeting would be for. Ms. Weglein responded “To make the decision on what we are going to do.”
Mr. Keegan seconded Mr. Smith’s motion. Ms. Weglein requested the recording secretary to read back the motion. Mr. Malek corrected “hiring deadline” to reflect the deadline to accept resumes. The Board concurred to let Mr. Austin present his interview.
Mr. Austin’s qualifications include a number of senior positions in both the public and private sectors, some of which are international in scope. He has been with the Bay for a year which has given the Board an opportunity to observe his work. Hiring Mr. Austin would represent a cost savings as he would perform the interim function as well as his current position as Code Director. Most of the legwork has been done on hurricane concerns in the community which would allow Mr. Austin to handle the interim position.
Mr. Smith requested to hear Mr. Austin’s background. [Resume attached: Exhibit B]
Mr. Austin’s experience prior to Barefoot Bay included 5 years as a senior project manager at a software manufacturing company in Fairfax, VA. Prior to that he managed a group involved in generating non-English speaking software. Mr. Austin commented his software experience is on the development side which is analogous to the Bay’s financial software. Mr. Austin has a degree in electrical engineering.
Mr. Keegan asked what were some of the things Mr. Austin could accomplish in an interim period with his skill base. Mr. Austin replied part of the challenge is to get information from the financial software expediently since Code Enforcement is now collecting fines. Mr. Austin commented that applying a new computer system to a “live environment” is one of the hardest things to do. Mr. Austin feels his knowledge of the current system and his background will provide continuity.
Ms. Howard pointed out when Mr. Hunt performed both functions, community manager and code enforcement chief, it was a hurricane situation. She asked how much time Mr. Austin would spend “on the street” in his Code capacity if he were interim manager. Mr. Hunt asked Mr. Austin to spend approximately half his time on patrol and half his time managing. The hurricane work is currently in the system, which frees up time for managing. There are two patrol officers besides Mr. Austin, and an excellent clerical staff. Ms. Howard asked if Mr. Austin were to become interim manager what role Ed Geer would continue to play. Mr. Austin responded Mr. Geer’s duties wouldn’t change since projects that require his attention are currently in progress.
Ms. Weglein commented regarding snags in a recent Violations Committee hearing. She felt the Code process requires Mr. Austin’s full time attention. Mr. Austin responded the first case involved “exposed wood”, which in current practice means wood not covered with aluminum or vinyl per the DOR. The owner, following the advice of his attorney, contended that painted wood is not exposed. Mr. Austin authorized a change in the language on all future cases dealing with wood not covered per the DOR, which currently requires aluminum or vinyl. Mr. Austin said this is part of the evolutionary process. Ms. Weglein pointed out that as community manager Mr. Austin would be responsible for everything. Mr. Austin responded the element that would change would be his patrol duties which now take up to 4 hours a day.
Mr. Smith asked if Mr. Austin would agree to “get off” Code Enforcement and spend all his time in the interim position. Mr. Austin said he believes Code Enforcement needs the position he is currently in to keep people focused. Mr. Smith insisted the Bay needs an interim manager. Mr. Austin explored his and Mr. Geer’s duties. He said Mr. Geer’s duties are part of the “critical path”. In the case Code Enforcement lost, the wording will be changed and the case will be brought back next month.
Ms. Howard commented Mr. Hunt came from a position that allowed him to be current with management practices and to move into a similar environment. She asked Mr. Austin how long it has been since he was in a similar position. Mr. Austin responded he has been away from the Globalization Engineering Group for a year.
Ms. Donahue asked if the Board were considering management companies for the interim position. Ms. Weglein felt it would take too long to investigate management companies for the interim. Mr. Malek reminded the Board audience participation would be allowed at Monday’s meeting.
Al Glashauser came to the podium and reminded the Board when Mr. Hunt came on board there was a Code Enforcement officer on duty. Mr. Hunt let the man go in an attempt to save the District money. However, the District did not save money with that arrangement. If Mr. Austin feels he can do both jobs, the Bay does not need a full time Code Enforcement Director. Mr. Glashauser was adamantly against splitting jobs.
Ms. Donahue commented the District needs current job descriptions for the community manager and the employees. Ms. Donahue wants a time management conciousness. She would like to see meetings with employees at least every two weeks. Ms. Donahue proposed a workshop to hash out exactly what the Board wants. Mara Marsocci is still using Elke Butti’s job description. Computer procedures are from “two systems ago”. Resolutions need to be current without having to look back through minutes.
Ms. Weglein asked Mr. Malek if the Board, based on the motion, must wait until the close of business “today” to vote on an interim manager candidate. Mr. Keegan asked if the motion stated “at the end of the business day”.
The recording secretary was asked to read back the motion. “Mr. Smith’s intent may not have been completely clear to anyone except Mr. Smith because it said basically that he wanted to move the deadline ahead to allow Mr. Austin to speak and interview. The last part of it is kind of open. Mr. Malek spoke up and said we might want to make that through to the end of today’s business day. That was Mr. Malek’s suggestion, and I don’t know what, or if, any other action was taken by the Board on Mr. Malek’s suggestion.”
Mr. Keegan asked, “So the motion did not say the end of business today.”
Recording Secretary: “Not according to Mr. Smith it didn’t.” Mr. Malek agreed the wording had been his suggestion.
Ms. Weglein said it was not part of the motion so [we] can vote on it now.
Ms. Donahue made a motion to hire Grace Daddario as an interim employee, but not the manager, to help Mara. Second Ms. Howard.
Mr. Keegan clarified if the Board hired Ms. Daddario as a consultant, she couldn’t be hired as a community manager. Ms. Weglein said, “That’s right.” Mr. Keegan asked if Ms. Daddario were happy with that.
Ms. Daddario: I’m a little bit distressed that you’re all of the assumption that a manager is not capable of doing more than one thing. The financial side of your problem is just a day to day as far as my experience has been concerned. I am more than capable. Keep in mind this is an interim position. The person in that position will be responding to current needs and requirements that are already in place. It’s a matter of offering continuity. What I will add to that continuity is my expertise in the financial side with the software application conversion and possibly, hopefully, your financial statement and reports as an added bonus to the interim position. But as a manager, I am well qualified in coordinating the efforts of, if I’m not mistaken you have 80 employees here, who are already doing a reasonably good job. It’s just a matter of them continuing in their job and coordinating their efforts, and going forward with the goals we’ve already set in motion for the community. So I would hope you would not discard my opportunity as an interim manager and assume I would not be able to take care of your financial problems at the same time. Thank you. “
Yvonne Claiborne of Bray Beck and Koetter responded the financial condition of the District right now does not lend itself to someone just handling day to day operations. The books are now a year delinquent. The issue with the software needs to be resolved. [We] cannot even come in to train Mara because the District can’t get a product in place for which [we] can even develop a training program. What Mara needs is someone [in there] full time 1) to help her get caught up; 2) to implement the new software; and 3) train Mara on the financial management piece.
In the audit presentation, not only were job descriptions discussed, the comment to the Board at that time was [your] policies and procedures are sadly aged and not representative of current practice. Ms. Claiborne read from Ms. Daddario’s resume months ago, when she applied for the position that Mara is now in, a solution. Ms. Claiborne based that recommendation on the fact that the Board had given Mr. Hunt the authority to hire an interim person to help Mara in finance. That position is still not filled. Ms. Claiborne was looking at this process as an opportunity to fill the position as it was authorized by the Board.
Ms. Donahue commented Grace Daddario is a resident of Barefoot Bay; would it be a conflict of interest? Mr. Malek said not necessarily. Mr. Malek urged the Board to hire an interim manager and then direct the interim manager to fill the interim position that Ms. Claiborne discussed. The Board’s main focus is come Wednesday, there will be no manager. One of the first priorities for the new interim manager seems to be to get Mara some assistance.
Mr. Carillion said Ms. Daddario seems to have financial expertise. The Board allows the manager, whether it’s interim or not, to do the hiring of all the people with the exception of themselves. Mr. Carillion made a motion to hire Grace Daddario as the interim manager; then she can hire the consultant for Mara. Mr. Carillion included in the motion that Ms. Daddario should be hired for as long as [we] need her, at a salary to be negotiated later. Second Ms. Richards.
Mr. Malek pointed out there were two open motions on the table. Ms. Donahue withdrew her motion. Ms. Howard withdrew her second.
Ms. Howard asked if Ms. Daddario had financial expertise, why would the District have to hire someone to train Mara? Mr. Carillion replied the scope of the problem requires someone to assist the financial position. The consultant is a temporary hire.
Ms. Claiborne responded her knowledge of Ms. Daddario is from reviewing her resume and previous discussions with Mr. Hunt. The role of community manager is such that with all the other responsibilities the community manager has, a focus on the financial end would take away from the other responsibilities to the detriment of the District. Ms. Claiborne said she was not present during Ms. Daddario’s interview and could not speak to Ms. Daddario’s skills or her references. On paper [you] would expect Ms. Daddario in the community manager position would have a fairly comprehensive understanding of the finance piece and could direct Mara and this other person. Ms. Claiborne’s impression of the Board’s direction is that the consultant to the financial manager needs to be a dedicated position. It was a benefit to the District that Ms. Daddario has the finance piece. Bray Beck and Koetter is trying to save the District money; the consultant position will cost less than Bray Beck and Koetter performing the training.
Ms. Howard asked if Ms. Daddario could have been the District’ s financial manager six months ago? Ms. Weglein said “Yes, she did, but the salary requirement at that time was more than the Board felt it could afford.” Mr. Carillion said that Ed Geer was doing a great job with the special projects which would free up Ms. Daddario to help Mara with the financial software. Mr. Carillion said he thought Mara was doing a good job, too, and had not received the necessary training.
Ms. Weglein asked for a time limit. Mr. Carillion would like to have Ms. Daddario start on Monday, and proposed 3 months. Ms. Weglein proposed 4 months with a possible extension. Mr. Malek clarified that in the event the Board finds a permanent manager before that time . . . . . . . . Mr. Carillion said he wished it to be part of his motion that when a permanent manager is found, Ms. Daddario’s services would be terminated with a 30 day notice. Mr. Carillion amended his motion to reflect that Barefoot Bay Recreation District could tender a 30 day notice when a permanent manager was found, and Ms. Daddario can tender a 30 day notice should she so desire. Ms. Richards amended her second.
Ms. Weglein asked the recording secretary to read back the motion: “It sounded more like a nomination to begin with, but Mr. Carillion used the words “made a motion” to hire Grace Daddario. Ms. Richards seconded it. After discussion it has been amended to include that the provision would be in there for a 30 day notice if Ms. Daddario didn’t want to work for us anymore, or we found a permanent community manager before 3 or 4 months was up. And that’s basically the way it stands right now. Four months, six months, [we’ve] been playing with that for a while. It seems to come down to as long as we need an interim manager, if we find a permanent community manager that takes precedence.” Mr. Malek concurred with 4 months and it could be extended.
Mr. Keegan asked if [we] could talk about a salary before the vote. Ms. Howard reminded the Board the candidates had allowed the Board to express terms it felt were fair in regard to salary. Mr. Keegan said that on the meeting on Monday Mr. Torpy suggested the negotiations start with the candidate coming to the Board, and then the Board would discuss it. Mr. Malek commented this motion would enable the Board to offer a position to Ms. Daddario. If Ms. Daddario does not agree with the terms, she is free to reject it.
The motion carried . Mr. Smith opposed in favor of a secret ballot. Mr. Malek asked Mr. Smith if he opposed the vote. Mr. Smith said yes.
Mr. Carillion made a motion to have Ms. Weglein negotiate with Grace Daddario, then take those results to Mr. Malek who will poll the Board for approval. Second Ms. Howard. Motion carried unanimously.
961 Cashew: Code Enforcement fines have accrued in the amount of $6,600. Ms. Donahue made a motion to reduce the fine to the amount of the costs or $209.40.
Second Mr. Keegan. Mr. Carillion moved the question. Motion carried unanimously.
922 Hemlock: Mr. Carillion made a motion not to reduce the fine. Second Mr. Keegan. Motion carried. Ms. Donahue was opposed.
The billiards room: Ms. Weglein proposed that Ms. Daddario look into restoring the system of asking pool floaters and pool hosts in search of extra hours to monitor the billiards room during the hours young people are allowed in there without parents or grandparents. Ms. Donahue agreed to talk with Ms. Daddario.
Eddie Geer spoke for Jim Reilly, Maintenance, and Mr. Bailey, Trustee liaison to maintenance, asking for two floor burnishers. Mr. Geer found two on the Internet that would cost half of what one would cost through a vendor. Mr. Keegan made a motion to accept the two burnishers Mr. Geer found on the Internet as being “the most economical ones we can get.” Second Ms. Richards. Mr. Geer said usually when shopping on the Internet taxes and shipping are free. Motion carried unanimously.
Mr. Keegan said he received two letters regarding contractor interference. Mr. Keegan asked Mr. Hunt to read his memorandum to Mr. Torpy. (Exhibit C) the second is a fax to Mr. Hunt from Mr. Macht, proprietor of the 2002 Restaurant in the shopping center.
Mr. Keegan said he is liaison to the pier. He wants to preclude any interference of the type just mentioned with the pier contractor. Mr. Carillion asked Mr. Hunt if he received an answer from the lawyer. Mr. Hunt said he would let the attorney explain the situation. Mr. Malek said in response to the question of whether or not the Bay has any kind of remedies, unfortunately this is no different than an average guy in the street going up and “hootin’ and hollerin” at our contractor. On behalf of the Bay the attorneys can write a letter to the painting company and explain they should only take direction from the Community Manager or the Barefoot Bay officials. There is no other legal action to take against the individual named in the letters. With respect to Mr. Macht’s request, Barefoot Bay Recreation District is not an enforcement agency. If he has a problem with Mr. Bleau, he needs to address it with Mr. Bleau. Not all provocations are actionable.
Cameras: Mr. Hunt said cameras at Pool 1 are being deferred, and additional security devices are planned for Pool 2. Mr. Geer will present those plans and projected costs at a later meeting.
Bussen and Mayer have not returned four phone calls so far. Mr. Hunt believes they may not want to be involved in [our] project. In the meantime, the project continues to work fine. Mr. Hunt urged the Board to stand firm and not waste more money on a project that continues to work perfectly.
The pier is on schedule. Mr. Hunt pointed out the yellow raft is Mr. Raff’s own invention.
Canal cleaning is approximately 80% done. The District held back $7,000 to ensure a complete contract. There are several areas that need to be redone.
Mr. Santos and his crew are back to painting the shopping center.
The Golf course tent is ordered; shipping is free, and the District saved $1,000 on the price of the tent.
Mr. Hunt asked Frazier Engineering to contact him regarding the permits for the maintenance building. Mr. Hunt wishes to include the most recent information in his after action report to the Board.
Ms. Howard asked if Mr. Santos had his license problem straightened out. Mr. Hunt responded Mr. Santos subcontracted with a licensed contractor and is working under that person’s license.
Mr. Keegan thanked Mr. Hunt for his time and effort during his time here, and said he considers that Mr. Hunt did a great job.
918 Laurel Circle: the Board of Trustees had authorized a reduction of fines subject to demolishing the house and clearing the property. The legal office sent the agreement to Mr. Stoangi. As soon as the agreement comes back, the legal office will present it to Ms. Weglein for signature.
637 Hyacinth: the legal office contacted the estate’s attorney in an attempt to get a proposal that will bring the property back into compliance.
Ms. Weglein commented Ms. Howard requested she be removed from the Homeowner’s liaison position. Ms. Richards will attend HOA meetings. Sunday, October 15, HOA is hosting a forum for the candidates in Building A at 2 p.m. Mr. Santa Maria advised the Board Mr. Goodfriend has been removed from the Violations Committee. The Committee is seeking an alternate.
Ms. Richards reported the October 3rd HOA meeting was a Board meeting. Julius Santa Maria took exception to the changes in the by-laws as presented at the August 18th meeting. He requested a meeting to discuss the changes before the next regular meeting. Pat Clark is publicity chairperson and ensures HOA’s information gets out to the public. Dick Gee delivers 400 copies of the HOA newsletter, putting them in Building A and the library. Vicky Rosso is the by-laws chairperson. Nancy Eisele is on the new development committee and reports that new development on Micco Road could result in a 600% increase in density. A committee is being formed to conduct fundraisers for residents who cannot afford to fix up their property. Louise Krause said telephone directories are still being given out in Building B and changes are still being accepted. There will be sign-ups for exemption from the fire tax on October 6 from 3 p.m. to 7 p.m. in Building D & E. Dale Page will be president next year. Dick Gee will be 1st Vice President, Nancy Eisele will be 2nd. The secretary position is open. Fred Van Watt is Treasurer; Bill Sandt is sergeant at arms. Gabrielle Davis, Vicky Rosso, and Pat Clark are directors. Commissioner Voltz will speak at the general meeting in November.
Mr. Keegan agreed with Mr. Hunt on withholding $7,000 to ensure completion of the canal contract. The veterans’ building is delayed in permitting problems.
Mr. Carillion presented the ARCC and Code Enforcement reports for the month of September. (Exhibit E, F)
Mr. Smith presented the Golf Committee meeting report from October 6, 2006. Mr. Kormandy reported the netting and signs for the D&E parking lot are on order. The golf course is in great condition. In November there will be 3 openings on the Golf Committee. Interested persons should submit letters of interest.
John Barry thanked who ever cleaned the storm sewer drains. The pipe behind his house needs to be replaced. Mr. Barry requested security measures for vandalism in the Bay. He thanked the Board members for their service.
Nancy Eisele said a straw vote was approved unanimously to the effect that the residents do not want the comprehensive plan changed to increase density on Micco Road. A resolution is being sent to the Commissioners. Ms. Eisele urged residents to update their badges. She praised the fire tax turnout.
Raymond Macht concurred that Barefoot Bay Recreation District might not be able to do anything in the matter of Mr. Bleau, but as a landlord, there is a clear line of harassment going on and there should be a way to protect tenants. Mr. Malek suggested the matter be brought to the Community Manager’s attention. Mr. Macht said Mr. Bleau slandered and defamed him in language he could not repeat in front of ladies. Mr. Malek clarified that someone on the roof taking pictures is the community manager’s province. Mr. Macht will have to “do what you have to do” regarding slander and defamation.
June Lane commented residents need to acknowledge the Bay is a multi-age community. Ms. Lane observed in 2001 right after the pool tables had been recovered that a man, not a youth, carried beer into the billiards room and spilled it on the new tables. She cited instances of adult temper that results in damage to pool cues, cue balls and walls. Ms. Lane urged the Board to consider all age groups when making decisions.
Al Glashauser commented the Board is setting a bad precedent by authorizing two [floor] scrubbers. Mr. Glashauser said the Board had no idea what was in the operating budget, and the request should have been made through the Community Manager. Mr. Glashauser objected to Ms. McCahan’s request on behalf of the Food and Beverage department. He said expenditures should come from the department heads to the manager.
Pat Clark objects to the condition of the shuffleboard courts. She contacted Ed Geer at Jim Reilly’s suggestion. Mr. Geer informed her he was getting bids on repairs. Ms. Clark commented she has seen children dueling with the shuffleboard poles and when they do shuffle, they dent the disks.
Mr. Carillion asked the Board to direct Ms. Daddario about getting security in the Bay. Ms. Howard objects to kids being out on skateboards until 11:30 at night. She said she’d rather channel some of the project money to security than have “what we’ve got going on”. Ms. Weglein asked Tres Holton of Commissioner Voltz’ office to speak with her about a greater Sheriff’s presence in the Bay. Mr. Carillion commented Tom Jenkins was now in the Sheriff’s office and suggested Ms. Weglein ask him what can be done.
Ms. Richards congratulated Grace Daddario on her appointment to Interim Community Manager.
Ms. Weglein entertained a motion to adjourn. Ms. Donahue made the motion to adjourn. Second Ms. Howard. The motion carried unanimously. The meeting adjourned at 3:45 p.m.
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